14 passes, 3 museums and a Grand Prix....

[fb.george]

Fresh back from a great holiday to the Valais region in Switzerland, I thought I would put some substance around my planned Europe trip next year, as I have spoken to a few people on here about it before.

I am conscious of Bruce's organisation of the 10 year event next year and it is worth me saying that I will be undertaking this trip next September with my Lad come what may. So this isn't any sort of "pitch", far from it. A few people I have spoken to, however, have expressed interest in what I was planning, hence this post, and if people did want to join us then I am happy to do the legwork.

Equally, I know there are many seasoned Alpine campaigners amongst the Forum ranks and as I have not undertaken a road trip of this ambition before, any comments or tips would be gratefully received.

In essence the trip boils down to three parts

- Passes
- Museums
- F1

The crux is the Italian GP. The date has not been announced yet but it is usually the 2nd weekend in September. I am therefore working to the 12th to 14th September 2014.

I don't want to put unnecessarily boring miles on the Atom, either, so intend to take the Motorail down. There are two that go to Alessandria from Dusseldorf or s'Hertogenbosch, and both seem to run only on Fridays. I am therefore using Friday 5th September as a fixed start date.

The itinerary then runs

Saturday 6th September
Arrive Alessandria
Drive to Andermatt, via Martigny and the Grand St Bernard pass with, after my recent holiday, a quick detour up to Verbier for afternoon tea!
This is around 400km and 5hrs of driving plus stops.
Stay Andermatt.

Sunday 7th September
Am targeting 200 miles and 5 hours of driving on these "pass" days.
There is a large figure of 8 from Andermatt, namely
- Oberalp pass to Disentris
- Lukmanier pass to Biasca
- part of Gotthard pass to Airolo
- Nufonen pass to Ulrichen
- Furka pass back to Andermatt
- to Wassen then the Susten pass to Innerkirchen
- Grimsel pass to Gletsch
- Furka pass to Andermatt for a well earned beer
Stay for a second night in Andermatt

Monday 8th September
- Gotthard Pass to Arbedo
- San Bernadino pass to Tusaun
- Arbula pass to Davos
- Fluela pass to Zernes
- Ofenpass to Santa Maria
- Umbrail and then a taster of the Stelvio pass to Bormio
Stay Bormio Monday night

Tuesday 9th September
- Stelvio pass in its entirety to Merano (likely an early start to get the best road conditions)
- SS238 road to Fonda
- mountain type roads to Riva del Garda at the north end of Lake Garda (avoiding the motorway route into Italy)
- then a motorway blat down to Modena
Stay Modena, which will be for 2 nights.

Wednesday 10th and Thursday 11th
Plan is to visit
- Ferrari museum at Maranello
- Lamborghini museum at Sant' Agata
- Pagani museum at San Cesario

over the two days and then fire across to Monza, ending up there for the first of 3 nights accommodation on Thursday 11th
Tom and I usually camp at GP's but lugging the tent may not be the easiest so may do hotel. Not quite got that far yet.

Friday 12th to Sunday 14th September
Soak up the atmosphere of Monza, the Tifosi, the banking and a fabulous weekend of F1.

Getting home
Leave after the face and make some progress North

Monday 15th September
I shall be using the Newcastle - Amsterdam ferry to get over to the continent on Thursday 4th September so it will be a full bore blast back through Germany to Amsterdam for us on the Monday.

This won't be a cheap trip but hopefully will be an unforgettable one, long thought about and made possible as far as I am concerned by the mighty Atom. Any comments, tips and advice welcomed, especially in relation to time needed on the passes. I have used Google maps so far in my planning and have a niggling concern I might be being too ambitious.

And if there is an appetite to join us, for all or part, let me know.

Ciao and thanks

[FlyingTrotter]

Done most of that - you wll need to factor in snow and mist/fog on some of your route in September - freezing fog in one of those alpine tunnels makes things interesting - was ok in a 911 - might be a bit different in an Atom in a helmet

Some folk who do more trips in Sept will I'm sure be along shortly - I have tended to do my trips June to August

[Alex Brandon-Smith]

Sounds like an epic trip and one I'd be interested in. Having done a few pass miles on the bikes in years past, I may say that some of the individual day mileage might be a little ambitious. Tourists, bad weather and the like (not least needing to stop to refuel driver and car can push the hours far beyond what Google recommends. If you think it'll take you five, add a few hours at least to be on the safe side so 8 hours driving per day for two days may be a little much but if you're staying in Andermatt for two days at least there you can change route a little to suit how you feel after the first day.

There is also a beautiful hotel part way up the mountain in Merano with superb garage space and a great hotel (ok this was four years ago now) but if the stay can take that place in for a night, you shouldn't regret it. Views from the restaurant are spectacular. I'll try to find it.

[Welshman]

Good itinerary. Ridden or driven all these passes so just a few comments.

GstB on day 1 is very nice driven from Aosta, but if you find time a bit tight then the Simplon will save you some. GstB on the North side is very tight and nadgery until you rejoin the tunnel road.

Day 2. Oberalp is very nice particularly the upward ramp from Andermatt. Lukmanier has good views but unless recently resurfaced it was quite rough. You don't drive any of the St Gotthard - it starts at Airolo which is where you will get off the motorway - very nice BTW - and immediately join the Nufenen road. Nufenen is lovely and it's quite modern so well engineered. Furka, again very nice as is the Susten and you are driving the Grimsel the righr way - it's much better North to South IMO.

Day 3. Gotthard pass good. When you get to the top where the refuge and museum are you can join the original pass road - the Via Tremolo - which is cobbled and very tight. far better again IMO to stay on the new pass road which is really nicely engineered.

I'm not sure of your route as I can't find the place Tusaun you mention but I guess you mean Thusis. San Bernardino is lovely. As you approach Thusis you can go on the new road or the old road the Via Mala. Old road better as the new one os a lot of tunnels.

I'm guessing that when you get to Thusis you'll head for Tiefencastel to get on the Albula - which I really like when it opens out at the top - but to get to Davos you'll get to Zernez and go North West over the Fluela, so your route seems to involve getting to Davos and then driving back over the Fluela - another top road - to get back to Zernez so you can drive the Ofen to Santa Maria where you turn to the Umbrail.

The Ofen is one of my favourite passes so enjoy that. At Santa Maria you turn right to get to the Umbrail. The first section is tarmac and very tight. It then opens up but at this point it is hard packed dirt and gravel until a mile or tow before the junction with the Stelvio. If you didn't know that then just factor the weather conditions in because if it's raining it will be muddy.

The Stelvio has a reputation as a must ride/drive pass, possibly because it's one of the top ten highest passes, but as a riding driving experience it is, again IMO, fairly crap. However, you may justifiably feel that it's one of those tick the box passes, in which case go for it.

As a rule if you can maintain a moving average of 30 mph on the pass roads you will be doing well so you may want to factor that into your planning.

[Alex Brandon-Smith]

Just to add to the thought processes, the Jaufen Pass just north of Merano heading towards Vipiteno Sterzing is also very good.

And following on from my previous shout about the hotel in the area, this was it...

http://www.hotel-miramonti.com/en.html

[Alex Brandon-Smith]

Oh and entirely agree with Welshman, the Stelvio generally is pretty crap to ride/drive but is pretty to look at and the Umbrail leading there is very poor in surface. I rode it on a bike and ended up standing for the majority of it it was that loose.

[Welshman]

[quote="Alex BS"]
Oh and entirely agree with Welshman, the Stelvio generally is pretty crap to ride/drive but is pretty to look at and the Umbrail leading there is very poor in surface. I rode it on a bike and ended up standing for the majority of it it was that loose.
[/quote]

Jaufen Pass

[fb.george]

Brilliant stuff Gents. Already reviewing the plan based on what you say. I had not appreciated the Umbrail was unsurfaced in part for example - was going from reading other sources of reference on the web and hadn't seen that mentioned.

Many thanks

[Welshman]

[quote="fb.george"]
Brilliant stuff Gents. Already reviewing the plan based on what you say. I had not appreciated the Umbrail was unsurfaced in part for example - was going from reading other sources of reference on the web and hadn't seen that mentioned.

Many thanks
[/quote]

Let us know the revised route for Day 3 as I couldn't work out what exactly you were planning.

As a general guide i'd say it would be worth investing in John Hermann's book "Motorcycle Journeys through the Alps and Corsica" - this gives you a wealth of information for planning this type of trip.

For photos of all these passes check the website in my signature. It's where we post trip reports of all our European jaunts.

[Alex Brandon-Smith]

[quote="Welshman"]
[quote="fb.george"]
Brilliant stuff Gents. Already reviewing the plan based on what you say. I had not appreciated the Umbrail was unsurfaced in part for example - was going from reading other sources of reference on the web and hadn't seen that mentioned.

Many thanks
[/quote]

Let us know the revised route for Day 3 as I couldn't work out what exactly you were planning.

As a general guide i'd say it would be worth investing in John Hermann's book "Motorcycle Journeys through the Alps and Corsica" - this gives you a wealth of information for planning this type of trip.

For photos of all these passes check the website in my signature. It's where we post trip reports of all our European jaunts.
[/quote]

Welshman, I think you and I went to the same school of Alpine Driving!  Great book that...

fb.george, this is really whetting the appetite mate!

[Osky]

fb.george: good trip! 

- On 08 September: there is the possibility to make a track day in the Imola circuit (for info: http://www.pistenclub.de/default.aspx?TabId=36&language=de-DE). I'll be there! 

- In Bormio I suggest you to stay here http://www.bagnidibormio.it/ . It isn't cheap, but the place is amazing! And I suggest the "Bagni Vecchi".

- On 10th and 11th, you will be very close to Bologna, so, if you want, we can meet!

Ciao
Osky

[Welshman]

[quote="Alex BS"]
[quote="Welshman"]
[quote="fb.george"]
Brilliant stuff Gents. Already reviewing the plan based on what you say. I had not appreciated the Umbrail was unsurfaced in part for example - was going from reading other sources of reference on the web and hadn't seen that mentioned.

Many thanks
[/quote]

Let us know the revised route for Day 3 as I couldn't work out what exactly you were planning.

As a general guide i'd say it would be worth investing in John Hermann's book "Motorcycle Journeys through the Alps and Corsica" - this gives you a wealth of information for planning this type of trip.

For photos of all these passes check the website in my signature. It's where we post trip reports of all our European jaunts.
[/quote]

Welshman, I think you and I went to the same school of Alpine Driving!  Great book that...

fb.george, this is really whetting the appetite mate!
[/quote]

That book is so useful. there's a great Dolomites trip called 17 passes in a Day. We turned it into 18 passes in a day. You can read about it here:

http://www.bbot.co.uk/ride-reports/dolomites-june-2009-day-7/

FbGeorge here's a suggestion for your Day 3:

Over the Gotthard to Arbedo

North East over the San Bernardino to Splugen

South over the Splugen to Chiavenna

East over the Maloja to San Moritz

North East to La Punt Chamuez

North West over the Albula almost to Tiefencastel

North East through Schmitten to Davos

South East from Davos over the Fluela to Susch and then Zernez

East over the Ofen Pass to Santa Maria

If the weather is good and the Umbrail OK then follow your plan up the Umbrail and down the Stelvio to Bormio.

If the Umbrail isn't OK then back over the Ofen - take it from me it is no hardship to drive the Ofen both ways - and back down to the Tunnel into Livigno and stay there the night. Hotel Cervo has a secure underground car park and VGV for the money. In the morning head over the Eira and Foscagno to Bormio and drive the Stelvio. At the top go up to the Tibetan Cafe which offers very good views assuming the summit is not cloud bound.

This route avoids you doubling back except possibly at the end but will take you a full day. It's 249 miles from Andermatt to Santa Maria, and then its a further 20 slow miles to Bormio or about 25 but quicker miles back to Livigno.

[fb.george]

Welshman

Love the website. Very informative.

Re John Hermann's book, is it worth £782.01?! That's the price for a new one on Amazon. There are 4 used starting at £174. Must be a bloody good book!! At least it gets Free Super Saver delivery.....

As an alternative there is Motorcycle Journeys through Western Europe by Toby Ballentine. A more palatable £20. Do you know if that is worth the money

Cheers

[Welshman]

[quote="fb.george"]
Welshman

Love the website. Very informative.

Re John Hermann's book, is it worth £782.01?! That's the price for a new one on Amazon. There are 4 used starting at £174. Must be a bloody good book!! At least it gets Free Super Saver delivery.....

As an alternative there is Motorcycle Journeys through Western Europe by Toby Ballentine. A more palatable £20. Do you know if that is worth the money

Cheers
[/quote]

Pleased you like our website. The credit goes to Kyle - mentioned frequently on the site - as he is a website designer. 2012 report will be up in a few weeks.

John Hermann book is very good and I even verified the £782 price on Amazon UK I was so gobsmacked. However, you can get it on the Amazon US site for $25 which seems a bit more reasonable.

I don't know the Ballantine book so can't comment.

The truth is that you can do without either book. You need Michelin 1: 250,000 or 1:400,000 maps which are fairly detailed. Just look for any road with a green edge - these are rated as particularly scenic and the usual concomitant is that they are good to drive/ride. I prefer maps for route planning rather than use say viamichelin.com, as you can see the big picture simply by spreading the map out. Where viamichelin.com or something like Garmin Roadtrip comes into its own is when you want to plot distances.

Did you find my suggested route to your liking? I know that I'd enjoy driving it.

[fb.george]

Welshman

The John Hermann book 5th edition is out on 1/1/14 at £17 so have ordered it.

Sorry not responded. Been away. Your route looks top and the hotel suggestions are welcomed thanks.

Just now waiting for the 2014 F1 Calendar to be finalised so I can get on and book the framework of this trip.

Thanks again