[quote="Mobile Centre"]
Thanks for your input - as only 5 or 6 people actually bought these in the end for Atoms makes re tooling at $15000 seem a shot in the dark excuse the pun. Thie original lights were a "joint"venture with Piers Chandler who was to make the backs which never materialised either due to lack of commitment.[/quote]
In all fairness, Piers posted the group buy announcement on May 24, 2007:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... l#msg88337
On August 14th, 2007 Randy said he'd like 2 sets for his own use and would like to offer them at AtomFest in October: http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg105432
On February 29th, 2008 you closed the group buy with an offer to extend it if we thought it would help get more buyers lined up. I replied saying I'd rather pay more for quicker delivery:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg139681
On June 14th, 2008 you said that the colored sets were in stock and would start shipping on June 18th, 2008:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg152684
The first report of receipt in the US was by me on July 7th, 2008:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg155135
That's 13 1/2 months from the opening of the group buy to receipt of units. Certainly, a fair amount of that was due to people here wanting clear lenses vs. colored, as well as at least a change of tooling / molds and possibly a change of manufacturer (contrast the lenses on Piers' car vs. the current units), and also some of us trying to convince the UK and US factories to adopt these lights. During this period, a number of people went off and found their own solutions, further reducing the potential market.
I'm stopping here so I can address your intervening reply in my next post.
Rover Antics LED lights etc...
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Terry Kennedy
Re: Rover Antics LED lights etc...
[quote="Mobile Centre"]
This brings us back to engineering a light for the Atom which will make the lamps very expensive. This is why when you go through this forum you find so many people re designing products left right and centre and setting them self up as engineers in their garden sheds which is great as a hobby but not commercially viable otherwise Ariel would of "made" a better component in the first place. The balance of cost versus performance is a tough one, it becomes even tougher in forums where everybody has an opinion and thinks they can go to the local electronics store and buy a few leds for $10 which they can but never bother doing EMC testing , E marking, CE, WEE etc etc I am all for saving some money which is what we tried to do by offering an LED solution which had been tested by Piers on an Atom which we had taken from a different environment but seemed to fit the bill. It has then transpired after some serious mileage the lamps have failed.[/quote]
As I said in earlier posts, if the River Runners were built to the standard that the 80x80 reverse lamp used, there would probably have never been any faults with them. Simply potting the back of the housing should prevent any future failures. Once I cut one open, I'll have a better idea on that. Doing the potting / encapsulation at the factory should not require additional testing as it won't be affecting anything but reliability.
I do believe that the units on Piers' Atom were from an earlier batch, with starburst ripples molded into the lenses, vs. the smooth lenses that we all received. If these were from a different factory that claimed they were "functionally identical", there's no way of knowing without cutting them open to see. As I mentioned in an earlier reply, you would have had no reason to do that before sending out the first lights, and if all defective units had to go back to the manufacturer, then the only people who know what failed are Barry (he did cut a couple open, though I'm not aware of the details of his findings) and possibly somebody back at the manufacturer.
This is why I suggested (in email) to you that you take some of the evaluation units and give them both the "drop test", as well as running them in a hardware store paint shaker for a couple minutes. Again, your 80x80 reverse lamp should completely ignore those two tests and keep on working.
This brings us back to engineering a light for the Atom which will make the lamps very expensive. This is why when you go through this forum you find so many people re designing products left right and centre and setting them self up as engineers in their garden sheds which is great as a hobby but not commercially viable otherwise Ariel would of "made" a better component in the first place. The balance of cost versus performance is a tough one, it becomes even tougher in forums where everybody has an opinion and thinks they can go to the local electronics store and buy a few leds for $10 which they can but never bother doing EMC testing , E marking, CE, WEE etc etc I am all for saving some money which is what we tried to do by offering an LED solution which had been tested by Piers on an Atom which we had taken from a different environment but seemed to fit the bill. It has then transpired after some serious mileage the lamps have failed.[/quote]
As I said in earlier posts, if the River Runners were built to the standard that the 80x80 reverse lamp used, there would probably have never been any faults with them. Simply potting the back of the housing should prevent any future failures. Once I cut one open, I'll have a better idea on that. Doing the potting / encapsulation at the factory should not require additional testing as it won't be affecting anything but reliability.
I do believe that the units on Piers' Atom were from an earlier batch, with starburst ripples molded into the lenses, vs. the smooth lenses that we all received. If these were from a different factory that claimed they were "functionally identical", there's no way of knowing without cutting them open to see. As I mentioned in an earlier reply, you would have had no reason to do that before sending out the first lights, and if all defective units had to go back to the manufacturer, then the only people who know what failed are Barry (he did cut a couple open, though I'm not aware of the details of his findings) and possibly somebody back at the manufacturer.
This is why I suggested (in email) to you that you take some of the evaluation units and give them both the "drop test", as well as running them in a hardware store paint shaker for a couple minutes. Again, your 80x80 reverse lamp should completely ignore those two tests and keep on working.
-
silver
Re: Rover Antics LED lights etc...
Tim....and others,
I didn't mean to stir up any controversy, but, it looks like everyone's feeling a little bit better after being able to speak their minds.
To you point earlier, "off the shelf parts" is why I purchased the turn signals I chose to purchase, and also why I purchased the reverse and license plate light from you.......because they are inexpensive.
umm, and that's all I wanted to actually say....thanks for having inexpensive parts....saves me $15000 to design a new one
I didn't mean to stir up any controversy, but, it looks like everyone's feeling a little bit better after being able to speak their minds.
To you point earlier, "off the shelf parts" is why I purchased the turn signals I chose to purchase, and also why I purchased the reverse and license plate light from you.......because they are inexpensive.
umm, and that's all I wanted to actually say....thanks for having inexpensive parts....saves me $15000 to design a new one
-
Mobile Centre
Re: Rover Antics LED lights etc...
[quote="Terry Kennedy"]
[quote="Mobile Centre"]
Thanks for your input - as only 5 or 6 people actually bought these in the end for Atoms makes re tooling at $15000 seem a shot in the dark excuse the pun. Thie original lights were a "joint"venture with Piers Chandler who was to make the backs which never materialised either due to lack of commitment.[/quote]
In all fairness, Piers posted the group buy announcement on May 24, 2007:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... l#msg88337
On August 14th, 2007 Randy said he'd like 2 sets for his own use and would like to offer them at AtomFest in October: http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg105432
On February 29th, 2008 you closed the group buy with an offer to extend it if we thought it would help get more buyers lined up. I replied saying I'd rather pay more for quicker delivery:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg139681
On June 14th, 2008 you said that the colored sets were in stock and would start shipping on June 18th, 2008:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg152684
The first report of receipt in the US was by me on July 7th, 2008:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg155135
That's 13 1/2 months from the opening of the group buy to receipt of units. Certainly, a fair amount of that was due to people here wanting clear lenses vs. colored, as well as at least a change of tooling / molds and possibly a change of manufacturer (contrast the lenses on Piers' car vs. the current units), and also some of us trying to convince the UK and US factories to adopt these lights. During this period, a number of people went off and found their own solutions, further reducing the potential market.
I'm stopping here so I can address your intervening reply in my next post.
[/quote]
The group buy was conducted by Piers and not by us - he wanted to acheive a number of units so he could get the backs made and we offered to contribute towards that if we hit the 50 sets. When the buy closed we ordered which takes 4 weeks for manufacture then another 8 weeks for sea shipping then we shipped to you. We had no control over the group buy as we did not organise it as you can see from the threads Piers was unavialble another forum memeber said he would take over and byu 10 sets - in the end he did not even buy one set and so on.
[quote="Mobile Centre"]
Thanks for your input - as only 5 or 6 people actually bought these in the end for Atoms makes re tooling at $15000 seem a shot in the dark excuse the pun. Thie original lights were a "joint"venture with Piers Chandler who was to make the backs which never materialised either due to lack of commitment.[/quote]
In all fairness, Piers posted the group buy announcement on May 24, 2007:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... l#msg88337
On August 14th, 2007 Randy said he'd like 2 sets for his own use and would like to offer them at AtomFest in October: http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg105432
On February 29th, 2008 you closed the group buy with an offer to extend it if we thought it would help get more buyers lined up. I replied saying I'd rather pay more for quicker delivery:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg139681
On June 14th, 2008 you said that the colored sets were in stock and would start shipping on June 18th, 2008:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg152684
The first report of receipt in the US was by me on July 7th, 2008:
http://forum.atomclub.com/index.php/top ... #msg155135
That's 13 1/2 months from the opening of the group buy to receipt of units. Certainly, a fair amount of that was due to people here wanting clear lenses vs. colored, as well as at least a change of tooling / molds and possibly a change of manufacturer (contrast the lenses on Piers' car vs. the current units), and also some of us trying to convince the UK and US factories to adopt these lights. During this period, a number of people went off and found their own solutions, further reducing the potential market.
I'm stopping here so I can address your intervening reply in my next post.
[/quote]
The group buy was conducted by Piers and not by us - he wanted to acheive a number of units so he could get the backs made and we offered to contribute towards that if we hit the 50 sets. When the buy closed we ordered which takes 4 weeks for manufacture then another 8 weeks for sea shipping then we shipped to you. We had no control over the group buy as we did not organise it as you can see from the threads Piers was unavialble another forum memeber said he would take over and byu 10 sets - in the end he did not even buy one set and so on.
Last edited by Mobile Centre on Fri May 22, 2009 6:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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silver
Re: Rover Antics LED lights etc...
I received my reverse light and license plate light, 12 days after purchasing online, they work.
PIC 1 reverse light on........obviously hard to tell if this means good or bad
PIC 2 so I took a pic of the garage door, this is with no flash just the new reverse light
PIC 3 assembly and license plate light on but with flash
PIC 4 license plate light with no flash
If anyone else buys and is curious, I did drill new holes for the reverse light, and the license plate light (including holes in the frame for the license plate light only)
Installed in about 30 minutes...the reverse light is Immensly more bright than stock, the license plate light is similar in brightness to stock but does have the spotlight effect that is typical with this type of LED's........for me though, as long as it's lit up, I really don't care how easy it is to read at night.......if any police were to look at it their headlights would light it up the rest of the way anyhow.
PIC 1 reverse light on........obviously hard to tell if this means good or bad
PIC 2 so I took a pic of the garage door, this is with no flash just the new reverse light
PIC 3 assembly and license plate light on but with flash
PIC 4 license plate light with no flash
If anyone else buys and is curious, I did drill new holes for the reverse light, and the license plate light (including holes in the frame for the license plate light only)
Installed in about 30 minutes...the reverse light is Immensly more bright than stock, the license plate light is similar in brightness to stock but does have the spotlight effect that is typical with this type of LED's........for me though, as long as it's lit up, I really don't care how easy it is to read at night.......if any police were to look at it their headlights would light it up the rest of the way anyhow.
Last edited by silver on Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Mobile Centre
Re: Rover Antics LED lights etc...
Any warranty issues with the Rover Antics River Runners need to be addressed to www.roverantics.com these lights an be indentified by the picture below.
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