New battery needed?

[phil4]

Hi, for the second time now I've come across some odd behaviour....

Earlier in the year (April/May), I disconnected the charger, rolled the car out of the garage, helmet on, gloves on ready to go for a drive.

Flicked the switch, let the fuel pump prime and then pushed the starter... brmmmm click click click. So I stopped. Sounded to me like a flat battery. This despite lights and dash working.

I popped it back in the garage on a different charger and let it charge away. Half a day later, it's back right as rain.

No problems since, not with Summer Gas or similar. Until today, same thing. The charger (a CTEK) is showing all stages lit, so charged. Yet try and start it and brmmmm click click click again.

The first time I thought it was the battery, and I'm still inclined to think that's the case, but what puzzles me is two fold:
1) The charger thinks it's charged, and after a period charging... it works.
2) The tracker company have in the past called me when the battery is disconnected... surely if it's flat they'd have done the same... but no.

So what do you think? Could it be something else odd, like starter motor on the way out... or is this almost certainly a battery issue?

Thanks

Phil

[phil4]

Ok, I’ll add to the strangeness.

Since the last post I’ve had dinner and just tried it again.... and it worked no problems first time.

Since my first post I haven’t:
- unplugged or otherwise touched the ctek charger.
- touched, tested or otherwise done anything to the battery.
- moved the car in/out of the garage.
- done anything else I’m awake of.

My current theory is it’s one of two things:
1) the charger somehow crashing, and not until it’s kicked by the car starting it restarts.

2) something with the engine/starter that doesn’t like sitting still for too long (ie. would like to be started weekly/biweekly/monthly).

Any guesses?


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[smokin]

brmmmm click click click

Is the brmmmm the car actually starting (and then stopping) or just turning over?
If it's just turning over does it turn over slower and slower before clicking?
Does brmmm click click click all happen from a single press/hold of the starter?
Once it starts doing the clicking, do subsequent presses just give clicks or does it brmmm again?

[phil4]

No, it never quite starts, just turning over.

So just turning over, and no just seems to have one go before click click click, rather than churn churn churn type noise.

Yes, all from single press and hold of the start.

The brmmm, noise is -much- shorter on any subsequent attempt, it gets to click click much quicker.

Sorry for trying to use words to describe, but hope it makes at least some sense. I'd go and film it, but as noted it now seems to work again. Next time will defo film at least second attempt

But in the meantime if you have an inkling, I'd love to know what you think.

Cheers!!!

Phil

[smokin]

Sounds like the starter solenoid isn't getting enough juice to overcome the spring (am I right in assuming the clicking comes from the rear?), and a failing battery would be my first thought (as it was yours).

However, the charger should report faults, and as it's showing ok and full, I think it's unlikely to be the battery. How old is it? They usually have a date on them. If it's over 5 yrs then I'd replace just in case.

I had a similar intermittent problem but it wasn't just the occasional starting problem - it would cut out while running too. That turned out to be the battery's earty strap that connects it to the chassis. It had vibrated to the point of creating a fracture that would occasionally limit the flow. Easy check to do so well worth checking.

Starter relay is another possibility but usually they either work or don't.

[autobackup]

Sounds to me as if you might possibly have an intermittently poor connection - might be worth redoing the battery connections with a bit of vaseline.

I would also check the battery earth lead where it connects to the chassis and the positive lead connection to the starter motor solenoid.

If none of the above I would suspect the battery which possibly might be suffering from age related sulphation - how old is your battery?

Finally a possible reason might be that you simply have a slightly sticky starter Bendix which might benefit from a bit of lubrication?

[phil4]

Thanks both, the car is 4 years old, so expect the battery to be moving onto 5.

I'll get to checking the connections you mention, and replace the battery in due course. And then lets see if it comes back.

Thanks again!

Phil

[autobackup]

Phil

Your car might be 4 years old but how old is the battery?

It might have been manufactured much earlier than your Atom - I would endorse smokin's suggestion to check the date of manufacture on the battery itself!

My apologies about posting a very similar reply to smokin but he posted marginally before I did - in fact while I was still composing my reply - so they somewhat overlapped!

[phil4]

No apology needed, and I agree, battery defo older than the car.

[GraemeW]

Phil I think its more like your option 2. The battery itself sounds ok otherwise it wouldn't be intermittent? Could also be fuel pump or electrical connection related.

I had identical symptoms in another (not atom) car that is used infrequently. Coincidently it shares the Ctek charger with the Atom. After a bit of a hunt it turned out to be a circuit fault in the EMU part that controls fuel pump

[phil4]

Thanks Digger... Once I've checked the connections etc I think I'll definitely look into starting it up a bit more regularly, if nothing else that should hopefully expose the problem if it still exists, and preferably not just before I need it