DDM twin-charged upgrade kit

[SkinnyPaleGuy]

I am curious if anyone has driven an atom with DDM's upgrade kit.  I am very interested in it! 

SPG

[tarsman013]

i saw a report on it on youtube

they were so impressed with the power (not even 400hp)
we have members here pushing 500

this is nothing new to anyone in this community, actually the twin charging idea was first brought up here but was later dumped because of costs and how to configure everything.

frankly, id rather see just a turbo'd atom up for OEM sale along with the super charged option.  If hondas have been turbo'd for years (damn ricers...) i dont see why the atom cant be from the factory

[John H]

[quote="tarsman013"]
i saw a report on it on youtube

they were so impressed with the power (not even 400hp)
we have members here pushing 500

this is nothing new to anyone in this community, actually the twin charging idea was first brought up here but was later dumped because of costs and how to configure everything.

frankly, id rather see just a turbo'd atom up for OEM sale along with the super charged option.  If hondas have been turbo'd for years (damn ricers...) i dont see why the atom cant be from the factory
[/quote]
Ariel Uk won't do it as it will compromise reliability. Anyone who has fitted a turbo has ha d a world of stuff to deal with and has had to be very technically minded...................which most atom owners are not. Hence the reason they don't offer it as an option

[DarthChicken]

Paleguy.. when you get your car, lets go for a drive.  I have a turbo on mine, pushing about the same power they are getting twin charge.  Using a supercharger with its associated drag, along with a turbo isn't a great way of getting power.  It USED to be, when turbo's were laggy, but modern turbos, when matched with the engine properly, are not laggy at all.

[macpdx]

I will attest to the lack of turbo lag on Darth's car. 
There is a reason I wear a neck brace riding in that beast.

[DarthChicken]

Its even better now that i have that manifold/turbo leak beat into submission.. its 22psi all the time now 

[discom]

[quote="DarthChicken"]
Its even better now that i have that manifold/turbo leak beat into submission.. its 22psi all the time now 
[/quote]

Do you have any overheating issues on the track?

I have been given the opportunity to purchase a rebuilt FD2 engine that puts out 290HP and redlines at 9000rpm. It will be NA if fitted to my car and I am thinking that the higher redline may be more useful on the track. On the straights, I will not be as fast, but I think the corners will be where this engine will shine. Any advice?

[300hp]

Don't be too quick to dismiss the twincharger approach.  There are reasons why Volkswagon currently builds a twincharger production car in Europe.  I have an Atom 2 with the DDMWorks upgrade.  The resulting wide powerband is remarkable.  Wheelspin is of course an issue, even in third gear.

More importantly, I've been impressed with the expertise and enthusiasm of the DDMWorks organization.

I'll try to attach the dyno graph.  Bear with me, this is my first post on the Atom Club website.

http://us.mc510.mail.yahoo.com/mc/welco ... nd=2358690

[SkinnyPaleGuy]

i knew someone had to have experienced one.  i'm going to look into this more. 

Darth,  did you say 22 psi?!  any videos of it?  i am curious as to how it sounds.  I appreciate the offer and will happily take you up on it. 

  For now, i have to wait for the weather out east to let up before mine can be shipped.  probably for the best, i'm a little guy and open air exposure in these temps would turn me into an ice sickle.  And i simply cant imagine anything worse than just getting delivery and the weather being too poor to drive it.

[DarthChicken]

It's dead quiet to tell you the truth.  The BOV makes a little noise, but the whine of the supercharger is gone, and it sounds like any other car.  Which personally I like, as my ears used to bleed with the stock setup.  For WCA2, I wll have no issues meeting the sound requirements of Laguna Seca.

I have no doubts the twincharge setup works, I'm just saying that there are better ways.  Superchargers by their nature create more boost as RPM increases.  Higher RPM = higher boost.  Same thing with turbos.  So I'm not sure what the supercharger gets you at that point, other than more parasitic drag.  Even the little M62 is sucking off something like 40hp at redline if I remember correctly.  That's power I'd rather be putting to the wheels.

[Heywood-Yablowme]

If turbos were the best way to go..why do so many use superchargers? Don't get me wrong,I like both just fine..but I really don't see one being "better" than the other. They both cost about the same...maybe the superchargers run a bit more money.. they both seem to last about the same amount of miles...they both make LOTS more HP than would normally be available..maybe the turbo wastes less energy....but it is not as snappy as a supercharger,usually,from what I have seen.

I own 4 turbocharged vehicles and 5 supercharged vehicles. They all have their ups and downs. They are all fast. It would be hard for me to choose which one I prefer...if pressed..I would lean toward the supercharged ones providing me with the most enjoyment behind the wheel.

It really is more dependant on how the system is set up rather than how you compress the air.Superchargers seem to be more user friendly to tune. Turbos seem to make more power in the long run.

I have never tried a twin charge setup..but it seems counterproductive to overall performance (weight and complexity included in the formula) to have two different setups doing the same thing;compressing air.

I say choose one or the other, at this stage of the game..

[NormLarson]

[quote="DarthChicken"]
It's dead quiet to tell you the truth.  The BOV makes a little noise, but the whine of the supercharger is gone, and it sounds like any other car.  Which personally I like, as my ears used to bleed with the stock setup.  For WCA2, I wll have no issues meeting the sound requirements of Laguna Seca.

I have no doubts the twincharge setup works, I'm just saying that there are better ways.  Superchargers by their nature create more boost as RPM increases.  Higher RPM = higher boost.  Same thing with turbos.  So I'm not sure what the supercharger gets you at that point, other than more parasitic drag.  Even the little M62 is sucking off something like 40hp at redline if I remember correctly.  That's power I'd rather be putting to the wheels.
[/quote]

Darth, I know what you are saying, but, I would be very surprised if they did not incorporate a way of spinning the supercharger down when the turbo takes over.  We will see when more information is released.  One of my questions is why put the Harrop in if you are going to use a turbo for the rpm range where the Harrop is more efficient?  The M62 appears to be more than a decent choice for boost onset.  We will see ...

[silver]

[quote="MadMaxAtom and company"]
If turbos were the best way to go..why do so many use superchargers? Don't get me wrong,I like both just fine..but I really don't see one being "better" than the other. They both cost about the same...maybe the superchargers run a bit more money.. they both seem to last about the same amount of miles...they both make LOTS more HP than would normally be available..maybe the turbo wastes less energy....but it is not as snappy as a supercharger,usually,from what I have seen.

I own 4 turbocharged vehicles and 5 supercharged vehicles. They all have their ups and downs. They are all fast. It would be hard for me to choose which one I prefer...if pressed..I would lean toward the supercharged ones providing me with the most enjoyment behind the wheel.

It really is more dependant on how the system is set up rather than how you compress the air.Superchargers seem to be more user friendly to tune. Turbos seem to make more power in the long run.

I have never tried a twin charge setup..but it seems counterproductive to overall performance (weight and complexity included in the formula) to have two different setups doing the same thing;compressing air.

I say choose one or the other, at this stage of the game..


[/quote]

A: on the atom swapping to Harrop is much much cheaper then turbo (considering all ancillary items needed to run turbo and labor costs in building so many parts)
B:  you prefer the supercharged cars.............hmm is that because you have 3 superchard atoms hahahahhhahahha

[DarthChicken]

[quote="Norm"]

Darth, I know what you are saying, but, I would be very surprised if they did not incorporate a way of spinning the supercharger down when the turbo takes over.  We will see when more information is released.  One of my questions is why put the Harrop in if you are going to use a turbo for the rpm range where the Harrop is more efficient?  The M62 appears to be more than a decent choice for boost onset.  We will see ...
[/quote]

Exactly.  Are they using a very small turbo to spin up the power, and then have the Harrop take over?  Nope.. its a decent sized turbo they are using.  What's the point?

Max - agreed.  I'm a turbo man.  Always have been.  Turbo's have higher exhaust backpressure, so they are harder to tune.  Superchargers have drag.  Having both though.. the worst of all worlds? 

[Heywood-Yablowme]

The debate between turbo vs. supercharger will probably go on forever. I enjoy both.I def do drive the turbo cars differently than the supercharged cars. If you don't tune properly,(boost manaagement) the turbo can "hit" with its power.Even tuned,it can have areas where it surges its power delivery(creep).The supercharger is very linear and somewhat easier to drive in many circumstances. I have to detune my turbo track car if it is wet or cold.I don't with the supercharged cars. Other than that,I tend to go with the most simple solution to increase power on my vehicles.