Ariel.Club Forum

by **Wmcmanus** » Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:26 am

#4 (last one, I promise)

by **Wmcmanus** » Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:26 am

by **Wmcmanus** » Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:25 am

by **Wmcmanus** » Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:10 am

I picked up the 3/8" and 5/16" hex sockets today and managed to get the roll bar off. I then switched to my blue body panels and decided applied to little magic to create the first-ever wind powered Atom. Check it out!

by **Terry Kennedy** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 7:49 pm

[quote="Wmcmanus"]
Anyway, thanks Terry, Nick and Ken for your great advice. I'll bookmark this thread and start making some tool shopping progress at once.
[/quote]

You might want to check out http://www.mscdirect.com - much better quality than Harbor Fright and loads less expensive than the tool trucks.

by **Wmcmanus** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 7:40 pm

[quote="Nicholas"]
Wayne will use these at most once a month.[/quote]

...and only then if I have ABSOLUTELY nothing else to do. Taking off a roll bar is a lower priority than sorting out my socks drawer. But then again, if I were to get used to something like this, I could start posting about how many foot pounds of torque I'm applying and all sorts of other things that would suddenly become (genuinely, I assure you) interesting to me.

When Ken was trying to convince me to spend $150 for the mechanics took kit, my response was that this would be like spending the $400 or so that burned a hole in my pocket years ago for pots and pans and spatulas because someone insisted I would need that for my kitchen. In 12 years, I've yet to turn on the oven even once. I don't cook, period. Sure, I do get an occasional lady friend who would like to cook for me, so they've been used here and there, but not by me!

Funny though, because with these tools I suddenly feel the need to get my hands greasy. It must be the Atom that is doing this to me. Don't think I'd use them on any other vehicle. But the Atom is special, and kind of fun to tinker with.

Anyway, thanks Terry, Nick and Ken for your great advice. I'll bookmark this thread and start making some tool shopping progress at once.

by **Wmcmanus** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 7:24 pm

[quote="Driver"]
For the Allen bolt holding the rear stays of the roll bar do not get the L-shaped one, get a socket version and use that ratchet. Go back over to that Sears at the mall and get the right size individual one you need. I assume you've already tried the Allen bolts that were in the set. If not get one of the guys/Doug at Powerhouse to show you what size you need. One of their tool chests will have the one you need.[/quote]

Thanks, Ken. I figured the same thing in terms of borrowing the needed tools for now, but want to get my own so that I can take care of these sorts of every day things as I go. That's why I started the thread along more general lines, rather than JUST to solve this particular problem. If nothing else, I'll just go down the list that Nick has provided and try to fill in some of the gaps in terms of what I'm missing.

by **nickpoore** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 6:29 pm

My "complete set" of 8 pieces was $25.
I've used them some, but not every week.

I use them on track days for removing the wheels; at WCA I switched wheels twice a day (slicks vs road tires).
My cheap 12mm hex-wrench held up fine to an impact wrench at torque wrench on the 16 bolts, twice a day.
In fact, my Brammo 12mm "socket adapter" shows more wear.

If I were using them every day, or every week, I would buy expensive stuff.

Wayne will use these at most once a month.

by **Driver** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:37 pm

It doesn't have to be Snap-On. Pretty much all the auto tool suppliers (those trucks that visit the shops weekly) offer good stuff. Matco, Mac, etc... In a pinch, go Sears Craftsman. Regardless Wayne doesn't need to buy the complete set. Buy the one that he needs to get the roll bar bolts out only.

Just FYI, that Socket Driver pictured, Metric, Hex, Standard, 14 mm Stock#: FAM14E is $25.75 US.The complete set 4-14MM (11 pieces) is $237 US. 3/8" Set, Socket, Metric, Deep, 6-Point (12 pcs.) (8 to 19 mm) Stock #: 212SFSMY is $196 on their website.

I still have (over 20 years) a complete set of 6-pt sockets (8-20mm), good to know they are holding their value.

by **benyeats** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:25 pm

[quote="Mig"]
[quote="Driver"]
[quote="Mig"]
Mmmmmm do I see a Snap on allen socket Driver? quality quality quality

[/quote]

Why yes you do. But for Waynes purposes any from Sears Craftsmen, Mac, Cornwell, Matco will also suffice. Generally poor quality tools are never found in a working mechanic's box. They can't afford to have them break off in, strip out or otherwise mess up a paying gig. Speaking of which...

[quote="Nicholas"]
These are the best impact hex-wrenches I have found.
.....harborfreight..[/quote]

Harbor Freight and "BEST" are rarely mentioned in the same sentence. Cheap, yes. Junk, yes. Well maybe "best price" but that's not about the tool. Seriously.. The majority of their stuff (relating to hand tools) is poorly made Taiwan, China (insert 3rd world country) cr@p. Buy high quality tools, they'll last your lifetime. I've NEVER seen a hex head bolt require a IMPACT to assemble it. Manufacturers don't use them in that way as it would be the wrong application of that type of bolt for the job. Of course, I could be wrong although I doubt it. Not meaning to pick on you Nicholas, more of just warning fellow forum members just how bad a cheap tool can ruin your day. It only takes 2 minutes using a bad tool to cause you to spend the next X hours running around trying to extract a broken stud (tight header clearances suck), repairing stripped threads (helicoil in aluminum anyone?), etc... It can be hard enough even with the right tools, why complicate things more just to save a few bucks.
[/quote]

What sort of price are Snap on in the U.S. are we being fleeced over here? its about $400 for 3/8 deep sockets 8mm-20mm.

Ive been buying Snapon for 20 years now and the back up and service is great.

Mig

[/quote]

About half price in the US, so yes we are being fleeced

Ben

by **Mig** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:18 pm

[quote="Driver"]
[quote="Mig"]
Mmmmmm do I see a Snap on allen socket Driver? quality quality quality

[/quote]

Why yes you do. But for Waynes purposes any from Sears Craftsmen, Mac, Cornwell, Matco will also suffice. Generally poor quality tools are never found in a working mechanic's box. They can't afford to have them break off in, strip out or otherwise mess up a paying gig. Speaking of which...

[quote="Nicholas"]
These are the best impact hex-wrenches I have found.
.....harborfreight..[/quote]

Harbor Freight and "BEST" are rarely mentioned in the same sentence. Cheap, yes. Junk, yes. Well maybe "best price" but that's not about the tool. Seriously.. The majority of their stuff (relating to hand tools) is poorly made Taiwan, China (insert 3rd world country) cr@p. Buy high quality tools, they'll last your lifetime. I've NEVER seen a hex head bolt require a IMPACT to assemble it. Manufacturers don't use them in that way as it would be the wrong application of that type of bolt for the job. Of course, I could be wrong although I doubt it. Not meaning to pick on you Nicholas, more of just warning fellow forum members just how bad a cheap tool can ruin your day. It only takes 2 minutes using a bad tool to cause you to spend the next X hours running around trying to extract a broken stud (tight header clearances suck), repairing stripped threads (helicoil in aluminum anyone?), etc... It can be hard enough even with the right tools, why complicate things more just to save a few bucks.
[/quote]

What sort of price are Snap on in the U.S. are we being fleeced over here? its about $400 for 3/8 deep sockets 8mm-20mm.

Ive been buying Snapon for 20 years now and the back up and service is great.

Mig

by **nickpoore** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:11 pm

[quote="Driver"]
[quote="Nicholas"]
These are the best impact hex-wrenches I have found.
.....harborfreight..[/quote]

Harbor Freight and "BEST" are rarely mentioned in the same sentence. Cheap, yes. Junk, yes. Well maybe "best price" but that's not about the tool. Seriously.. The majority of their stuff (relating to hand tools) is poorly made Taiwan, China (insert 3rd world country) cr@p. Buy high quality tools, they'll last your lifetime. I've NEVER seen a hex head bolt require a IMPACT to assemble it. Manufacturers don't use them in that way as it would be the wrong application of that type of bolt for the job. Of course, I could be wrong although I doubt it. Not meaning to pick on you Nicholas, more of just warning fellow forum members just how bad a cheap tool can ruin your day. It only takes 2 minutes using a bad tool to cause you to spend the next X hours running around trying to extract a broken stud (tight header clearances suck), repairing stripped threads (helicoil in aluminum anyone?), etc... It can be hard enough even with the right tools, why complicate things more just to save a few bucks.
[/quote]

Point taken, and I generally don't by HF tools.

But in this particular case, they're the best that I've found, for the job that I needed.
Trying to get a 1/2" hex wrench from Sears was a complete waste of time.
Likewise with Home Depot.
Yes, I could have tracked down a SnapOn truck, but HF was just easy.

As to never using a hex-socket with an impact tool - it's the easiest way to get my wheels off.
That and the upright which gets torqued to 100 ftlb - they are good tools ready to go.

by **Driver** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:03 pm

[quote="Mig"]
Mmmmmm do I see a Snap on allen socket Driver? quality quality quality

[/quote]

Why yes you do. But for Waynes purposes any from Sears Craftsmen, Mac, Cornwell, Matco will also suffice. Generally poor quality tools are never found in a working mechanic's box. They can't afford to have them break off in, strip out or otherwise mess up a paying gig. Speaking of which...

[quote="Nicholas"]
These are the best impact hex-wrenches I have found.
.....harborfreight..[/quote]

Harbor Freight and "BEST" are rarely mentioned in the same sentence. Cheap, yes. Junk, yes. Well maybe "best price" but that's not about the tool. Seriously.. The majority of their stuff (relating to hand tools) is poorly made Taiwan, China (insert 3rd world country) cr@p. Buy high quality tools, they'll last your lifetime. I've NEVER seen a hex head bolt require a IMPACT to assemble it. Manufacturers don't use them in that way as it would be the wrong application of that type of bolt for the job. Of course, I could be wrong although I doubt it. Not meaning to pick on you Nicholas, more of just warning fellow forum members just how bad a cheap tool can ruin your day. It only takes 2 minutes using a bad tool to cause you to spend the next X hours running around trying to extract a broken stud (tight header clearances suck), repairing stripped threads (helicoil in aluminum anyone?), etc... It can be hard enough even with the right tools, why complicate things more just to save a few bucks.

by **Mig** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 4:12 pm

[quote="Driver"]
For the Allen bolt holding the rear stays of the roll bar do not get the L-shaped one, get a socket version and use that ratchet. Go back over to that Sears at the mall and get the right size individual one you need. I assume you've already tried the Allen bolts that were in the set. If not get one of the guys/Doug at Powerhouse to show you what size you need. One of their tool chests will have the one you need. SnapOn calls them Socket Drivers, Hex on their site. If all else fails, stop by ANY tool truck you see sitting by a auto dealer in the Atom and ask them to match it to the bolt in question. It'll look something like this:
[/quote]

Mmmmmm do I see a Snap on allen socket Driver? quality quality quality

by **nickpoore** » Thu Jun 26, 2008 4:07 pm

YOU NEED HEX WRENCHES.

You can never have enough of these with an Atom...

These are the best impact hex-wrenches I have found.
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/d ... mber=96225
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/d ... mber=96224

The first set is SAE, which are great for things like tightening the upright bolts.
The second set is Metric, which has the 12mm socket for things like tightening the wheel nuts.
(Yes, this is the best way to get a replacement wheel nut tool - and it's all in one with no socket needed.)

You also need decent hand tools, hex wrench set.
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00946292000P
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00946293000P

These are ball-end versions, which gives you more wiggle room when using the tool.

Yes, you have hex wrenches in your mechanics kit, but they're just the generic kind.
The ones listed above will give you much easier to use hand tools and power tool versions.

Talking of power tools - do you have a compressor?
An impact wrench and an air rachet go a long way to make the job easier.

You also need a torque wrench.
I ended up buying two, as I wanted a 200 ftlb one for the axle nuts, and now I don't use the small one.
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00944597000P

Now that you have the torque wrench, you can tighten the rear axle-nuts.
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00994188000P
You need this 30-mm deep socket, and the torque wrench set to 200 ftlb.

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